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Becoming Your Own Economy and Healing the Lie of Scarcity with Rha Goddess (008)

I was honored to speak with Rha Goddess about the intersection of purpose, money, and social impact.

Rha Goddess shares her journey of discovering that it is possible to be in your highest purpose, get paid well, and do good at the same time. She discusses the conditioning we receive from a society that tells us we need to look or be a certain way to be successful.

Rha emphasizes the importance of being true to yourself and finding success as your authentic self. She also talks about the role of spirituality in entrepreneurship and the need to cultivate a relationship with a higher power.

We explore the connection between personal healing around money and the impact it can have on collective and systemic structures. She encourages listeners to confront and forgive any place where they may be economically benefiting from someone else’s misfortune. Rha also discusses the importance of ambition and the need to redefine success and work in the current world.

Enjoy listening to all the powerful insights from our discussion!


Listen on…

Key Links

Key Takeaways

  • Success is about being true to yourself and not conforming to societal expectations.
  • Cultivating a relationship with a higher power can help in finding success and abundance.
  • Personal healing around money can have an impact on collective and systemic structures.
  • Confront and forgive any place where you may be economically benefiting from someone else’s misfortune.
  • Ambition is about being motivated to be all that you can be.


04:00 Rha’s journey to discovering the possibility of combining purpose, money, and doing good
07:46 The conditioning and societal influences that make people believe they can’t be successful as themselves
11:16 The influence of Rha’s mother and her “I can show you better than I can tell you” attitude
12:45 Lessons learned from family and creating financial abundance.
20:27 Gathering a mastermind group based on spiritual guidance.
27:30 The awakening of global citizenship and the need for purpose
43:51 The shift in focus and purpose after George Floyd
51:27 The danger of the zero-sum model
54:57 Rha talks about giving away training and the importance of the information.

About The Guest

Rha Goddess is the founder and CEO of Move the Crowd, an entrepreneurial soul coaching company. She is also a best-selling author and has been featured in Essence magazine and Time. Rha is known for her work in guiding change makers, spiritual leaders, and entrepreneurs to find their purpose, make money, and do good.

Show Transcript

[00:00:00] Kate: I have an incredible guest for you today. Her name is Rha Goddess. I’ve known Rha for probably 15 years and she has been my coach. I’ve been in masterminds with her. She has been a friend, a confidant. She is the best selling author of The Calling, Three Fundamental Shifts to Stay True, Get Paid, and Do Good.

If you are watching this video, you can see that this is my advanced reader’s copy of Rha’s and it is heavily dog eared because I inhaled this thing. Rha has been behind the scenes guiding the movements of hundreds of change makers and spiritual leaders and entrepreneurs. And she has been featured by essence magazine by time and more.

She’s the founder and CEO of move the crowd. She is an entrepreneurial soul coach and she teaches people how to. figure out what their purpose is or receive what their purpose is, how to make great money doing it and how to do good all at the same time. She is a true revolutionary weaving together the worlds of social change, activism, arts and entertainment and entrepreneurship.

And during this episode we talked about grappling with Being an artist and an activist and learning how to make money, how to have the courage to make money and be successful as yourself, especially in a world that has conditioned us to believe we need to look a certain way or be a certain way in order to be successful.

So we talked about renegotiating our relationship with work and how collectively we are in a moment where we are all asking bigger questions around what does success mean to us? What place does work have in my life and what really matters and what am I no longer willing to sacrifice for my work and for money?

We talk about God and we talk about guilt, especially in the context of liberation and privilege, and it is a juicy conversation. I could talk to Ra for days on end, but for right now, I have a very potent hour for you. So enjoy this episode with the wise, hilarious, and wonderful Rha goddess.

Welcome to plenty. I’m your host Kate Northrup and together we are going on a journey to help you have an incredible relationship with money, time and energy and to have abundance on every level. possible level. Every week we’re gonna dive in with experts and insights to help you unlock a life of plenty.

Let’s go fill our cups.

Thank you for being here. 

[00:03:09] Rha: My joy. 

[00:03:10] Kate: I just love you so much. 

[00:03:13] Rha: Same, same.

[00:03:13] Kate: I’m so excited to have this conversation. And I have some places of course that I know we’re going. Yeah. And I also am in total trust that we’re going some places that neither of us know yet. Yeah, that’s so worse. Yeah, I’m excited about the surprise of that as well.

Okay, so I want to start with How did you first get the idea or the notion that it’s possible to be in your highest purpose, get paid really well, and do good at the same time? Because those three things going together is not common knowledge, and most of us were not raised knowing that that’s possible, or even believing that it is.

So where did that come from for you? 

[00:04:00] Rha: You know, I think it was an evolution. Where it’s almost like one Eureka stacked on top of the other Eureka stacked on top of the other Eureka. And it was at a time when I was really in total breakdown, you know. I had been fighting the good fight, you know, and my joke is I signed up for the poverty trifecta, you know, artist, activist, spiritual person, it was like poor, poor, poor again.

And I was really confronted by the unsustainability of my identity. And so it was like one part identity crisis, one part real world, you know, breakdown. And I remember being on my knees and I remember saying, you know, if I am meant to do this work, if this is really, you know, the calling of my soul, then you gotta show me how to figure this out, God.

And, you know, God said to me, you know, humor, get a business education. I was like, excuse me. Get a business education. And it was interesting because I was like, okay, am I going back to school, am I, so I wasn’t really clear about where that guidance was going to take me, but I began to be introduced to really smart teachers who had built things from dust and who had been very, very successful.

And it’s interesting because in terms of the nuts and bolts of how to build a business and the nuts and bolts of how to organize and package and monetize and those were huge contributions to my knowledge bank. But it was the spiritual awakening that happened up through the middle that really shifted it.

The game for me because even in those rooms with the most incredible knowledge, there was still a value set that I believe was rooted in trade. There was still a value set that was rooted in a certain kind of hierarchy. You know, like they used to pat philanthropic people on the head and you know, and ask ’em when they were gonna make money

You know what I mean? And and I think it was through my outrage, quite frankly, in some of those spaces. That really caused me to continue to question, how do I do this my way? And if you were to ask me the number one thing that I think most people are struggling with, is that they do not believe that they can succeed as themselves.

Something has to be put on, something has to be added on, something has to be manipulated, something has to be shaved off or carved out. And I think people struggle with that because at a fundamental level what it says, the message is you’re not enough. You have to be different. If you want to survive, if you want to succeed, if you want to, and I think there’s something about my kind of indignation about that, that that’s the activist in me that was like, I, that’s not working for me.

Yeah. And. In my rebellion, what I actually discovered was actually the more me I am, the more everything becomes possible. Mm-hmm. , everything becomes available. And that was really the impetus of starting to figure out this true, this paid this good. And, you know, and, and, and really sort of declaring it.

That’s my new trifecta, my new, you know, I’m trading in my poverty trifecta for my tpe Good trifecta and. And it really has become an ethos for me. Yes. A way of living, a way of being, a way of teaching, and a way of working. Stay true. Stay true. Get paid. Do good. 

[00:07:46] Kate: Now, I totally know what you’re talking about with the, like, the number one struggle that people have is that, or the challenge, is that they think that they can’t be successful or, or have their dreams being who they are.

Where do you think that comes from? What are the forces making that the case that we need to be aware of? 

[00:08:06] Rha: I mean, listen, we get conditioning from day one about success being this external mantle that we’ve gotta carry, we’ve gotta live up to, we’ve gotta, we’re not defining our success. At the youngest of ages, we’re being handed a blueprint for what success looks like, and depending upon our background, our culture, our orientation, where we come from, the spaces we occupy.

That either continues to get strengthened or refined, or in some cases, maybe that gets challenged. But, because of the way in which our society and the indoctrination of our society is so immersive, it is very hard to escape the conversation of the trade. It’s very hard to escape the ways in which we are marketed and branded to about what success looks like, you know.

And, you know, let’s go here. I mean, I remember You know, growing up as a young woman of color and blonde hair, blue eyed is what you saw. That was the image of beauty that I remember sitting in personal growth trainings and being told that men prefer blonde women. And so I was like, listen, so I was like, okay, so what does that, you know, you know, what does that mean?

And I think you know, there are deeper struggles and deeper stories and narratives, right, that I could draw from. In terms of the way in which women of color have had to learn how to love themselves and be themselves. And we are still very much, you know, Kate on the forefront of that battle, but I think, you know, we all, no matter where we come from in some way, shape or form have had that conditioning that has at a fundamental level told us that.

That we gotta put something on, we gotta be something, we gotta sacrifice something, we gotta trade something, we gotta grind it out. You know there’s all of those narratives that ultimately put pressure on our ability to be at peace with ourselves and at peace with our enoughness. 

[00:10:12] Kate: And for you, where, what are the sources of the courage?

And I know, probably more in those earlier years, because as we both know, the older we get, the less we care. Yeah. But like, especially in those earlier days, what were the sources of that courage or bolstering for you that had you even be able to dig down and say, no, no, no, no, no. I know they’re telling me I can’t be successful as me, but I know I can.

Yeah. Where did you source that from, do you think? 

[00:10:50] Rha: It’s interesting. I think it came from a lot of different places. I mean, I definitely would say my lineage because of who my parents were. Very active in the civil rights movement. Very at the forefront of change. And change making. And very adamant.

And my mother in particular was a very interesting model for that. She was very much, I am the boss of you. That was her energy. She was a boss lady. 

[00:11:13] Kate: The boss of you and everyone else. And everyone else. Oh, right. Oh, come on. 

[00:11:16] Rha: You know. My mother would be like, Oh, really? Is that what you think? Huh? Watch. You know.

And she used to have a saying I can show you better than I can tell you. And I remember being in a conversation about like the vision for what I wanted to create and I was talking with this. He was this really phenomenal impact investor back in those days and he was like, I don’t know if you can build this.

I don’t know who you are. I don’t know this. I do. Who’s this audience? I don’t understand these people. This is what you say. Who knows what’s true? Blah, blah, blah. You know, all the doubt, right? And I swear I channeled the spirit of my mother and I just looked at him and said, I can show you better than I can tell you.

I see you. You know what I mean? And, and, and it was, that’s what gave me the courage. So I feel like. You know, I have this joke about 360 degrees of inspiration, you know, whether it pisses you off or it lights you up, it’s all inspiration, it’s all fuel to get to the real of real of the real. And I think those moments of anger, those moments of frustration, those moments of rebellion were fuel.

[00:12:25] Kate: Yeah. And what did you learn from your parents through both them showing you and also possibly them telling you about. I’m curious about. What’s possible in terms of doing good and be and making change like what? What did you learn? Let’s say by the age of 25. What did you already know about the possibility to make a dent in the universe?


[00:12:45] Rha: Yeah, I mean, it’s interesting because I feel like those lessons I got from the beginning like they were real clear about our value set. You know, it was family. It was community. It was there before the grace of God go I. It was if you ever got any opportunity, you had a responsibility to make a way.

Because of what they came from and what they lived through. So I feel like those things were really baked into the DNA of my being pretty early on. I think the get paid part, you know, they had a lot of change but not a lot of dollars. You know what I mean? Sounds good. You know what I’m saying, they were big on change but short on dollars.

Yeah. And so that part I had to figure out. And I had to kind of construct that myself. And I think, because of, again, so much of the conditioning, and if we look at it in the context of economics, and the way in which our world looks, and the people who get to be rich and thrive, versus the people, though it’s, thank God it’s changing.

We’re seeing it, you know, shift more and more every day. But there was a kind of courage, and a kind of permission I had to find. And there was a sort of way in which I was looking along the landscape, like, who are going to be my role models here? Right? And my original teachers, and this is just the truth of the matter, were white men.

And I’m thankful for them. I appreciate them. There were things that I got from them that were game changing for me. But in every turn, I had to make it my own. I had to figure out how to get that information to align. And that was really the impetus for starting Move the Crowd. That was really the impetus for creating it.

When the mantra, stay true, get paid, do good, came to me, I remember hyperventilating when we got to the get paid. Because I was like, this is ballsy. It’s ballsy to say to an activist community, get paid. Like, you have a right to get paid. You have a right to be financially sustainable. You have a right to be financially abundant.

Because I had to draw. outside of just the cultural and political and social economic analysis to find a place of truth where I could stand in having abundance and having sufficiency and having it really feel like it had integrity. Yes. You know what I mean? That it made sense, that it was grounded, you know, and you and I both know so much of what we often hear in the world when we talk about, you know, the laws of science and nature, you know, is wee woo and fairy dairy and, you know, all the, listen, you all know.

Y’all know how y’all get when you get angry. All of the terms that get thrown around but I believe in God. I’ve seen God move in my life. I don’t have, I don’t need, you know what I mean, I don’t even feel inclined to argue with anybody about it. Yes. I’m so clear about what I have personally been able to survive at the hands of God’s grace.

And so, it’s very grounding for me. You know, I have a very, very sobering and humbling and transformative and expansive relationship with spirit. So much so that I am unapologetic about my relationship no matter what stage or platform I’m in. I can’t, look, it is what it is, you know. But I will say that all the business education in the world does not serve you if you don’t have a relationship with source.

However you define it, something bigger than you’s got to be sourcing because the other aspects of who we are and what we struggle through, like we know entrepreneurship is a spiritual journey. There’s no, in my experience, there’s no Other front, maybe parenthood, where you meet yourself at every turn and you gotta make the decision, am I gonna grow, or am I gonna stagnate?

And to me, to not have a source filled relationship, really with anything you’re trying to do in this world I think it’s hard to do. And I feel like this redefinition of success, which is the work that I’m committed to, and Standing for, and the work that I know you’re committed to and standing for is rooted in recognizing that when you can allow yourself to be sourced by something bigger than you, when you can own that relationship and actively cultivate that relationship, that life does get easier.

Doesn’t mean you don’t have hard times, it doesn’t mean you don’t face challenges, but you don’t feel the same sense of isolation. And alienation. When you are out here, swinging by yourself.

[00:17:39] Kate: Did you grow up in a church? 

[00:17:44] Rha: I did. It’s interesting, so my mother, old school Southern Baptist. You know, so that’s like white gloves. That’s like pocketbook matching your shoes. That’s all of that. You know, and I will say that I definitely remember being a young child sitting on those hard ass benches.

Laughter Soaking in the word. Like, I definitely think that, you know, I have those vivid, vivid memories. But, when I think about the nature of my spirituality now, the nature of my spirituality feels transcendent. Meaning, I can sit in any space and find God. And, you know what I mean, and be at home with God.

Like, if the, if the, if the heart is pure, and the space is prime, I feel it, you know what I mean? 

[00:18:34] Kate: Is it okay if I tell the story of how you gathered our mastermind? Because it’s such a great story of this connection to source. So I got this email from Ra and we had known each other for a while. I was, I’d been working, I’d been coaching with you one on one.

Yeah. Okay. Well, okay. So, so. I am sure, I know this is not, this is not why you do it, but I am absolutely 100 percent certain that your deep connection to Source makes you more magnetic as a business woman. Because, I knew Ra for, I don’t know, like a decade. And then we were speaking together at Harvard Divinity School.

At this event, and I don’t know why, but I looked, I just felt so deeply in that moment. And I was like, Oh, I, I just have to work with raw. Like it was so clear. There was no question. It wasn’t even anything in particular you said, even though obviously you’re always brilliant. It was just a clear knowing.

And so that magnetism, so then we worked together, which, you know, I talked to you about that in the intro and, and the incredible results I have gotten. And so then I got this email from you and it literally said, spirit has been keeping me awake, has been waking me up. And I need to introduce you to and telling me I need to get this particular group of people in a room together.

Will you come to have dinner in New York? At the time, I was living in Maine and I had small children. This was not like a practical yes for me. But when Rha Goddess emails you and says, Spirit has been waking me up and needs to introduce you to these other people, you go. So I got on an airplane, and we sat in the room, and I am curious, so we’ll tell the rest of the story, but I’m curious, before I get into that, did you already know, so how, how did that happen for you?

Can you tell me, in what way did spirit keep you awake, and what was the invitation that you received? 

[00:20:27] Rha: Yeah, so one of the gifts of the work that I do, that we do. And, and I want to speak this in the context of people who are on the front lines of people’s humanity and working with people’s humanity.

And, and I am I feel privileged in a way that I talk to people all the time. So I’m in the interiors of every sort of facet of people’s lives all the time and I feel like it’s a humble honor and privilege. And what happens is I start to see patterns. I start to see dots connect. I start to hear conversations.

And what was happening was literally you ladies were saying the same thing verbatim. I mean, utilizing the exact same language. And I don’t think I’ve had a moment where that has ever been the case before or since. Or since. People point to similar themes. That all goes down. But I’m talking verbatim language, and verbatim context, and scenario, and literally, I was being tapped on the shoulder.

They need to know, they need to know, they need to know. There’s an opportunity to bring them together. There’s a conversation, there’s a body of work that wants to happen that is going to be integral to the root of what each of these women are here to do in the world, because every single one of you, we’re here.

To move masses and you all are doing it like it is happening, right? Like bar none it is happening you are doing it and and That was what happened, you know, and that’s what it was like from time to time. I will admit I’m a little hard headed Okay, I got that I’m gonna go run do this go run do that, you know, I’m busy I got things to do It was like you And then this particular night, like, up out my sleep, like, write the email, right?

And I mean, it was, I was up at three something, four something, and it was like, okay. And it was like dinner in New York, you know, and, and even for me at the time, I was based in LA. So it wasn’t even Not convenient. No. But it was like, you’re going to come to New York, you’re going to bring these women together in New York.

This conversation is going to happen. This body of work is going to happen. This is what it’s going to look like. 

[00:22:56] Kate: And so what, what happened is we sat in that room, in that, and you ordered this beautiful dinner. It was like really good roast chicken. I always will remember whatever we were eating. You did not tell us why we were all coming together right then.

But within, I think, three minutes of talking to each other, we all realized why. And the reason was because we all were in a conversation internally and a, and a struggle, quite frankly, with legacy and privilege and being born into families where our parent Had had some kind of extraordinary success and we were then following in line and finding our own way And I know people who have come into that scenario and not found it challenging But for whatever reason this particular group of women was we were grappling and so we came together and we did this mastermind That led by you for a year ten months around really exploring our identity in regards to privilege, specifically white privilege, and it was some of the most phenomenal work.

And so I want to read you a little part from your book, and I want to talk to you about it. So this is Ra’s book, The Calling, which I already talked to you about. This is my very dog eared advanced reader copy, which has moved with me to like eight homes. Okay Forgiving the greatest money myth of all.

Transforming the lie of scarcity is a game changer. Even so, the greatest myth we have to contend with in our global society is the disproportionate value we place on money. Because this tradition holds the biggest potential for derailing your purpose and challenging your liberation, perhaps more than any other.

And there’s more, but I’m just going to read it out of order. So you say, as you reimagine the role money will play in your life, I urge you to consider one final act of letting go. I’d like you to confront and then forgive any place where you may be economically benefiting from someone else’s misfortune.

And then later you say when it comes to money much of our modern activism is spawned from guilt and that in and of itself is a problem. Step one of the forgiveness ritual requires us to go look unflinchingly at and tell the truth about how we participate in this. What role do you play? Meaning participating in binding behaviors of complaining, blaming, judging, justifying, and or avoiding.

So. I want to know, how do we, in a world in which all of our economics are bound up in each other, and if you pull back the thread on any dollar a few steps back, it is dirty money. And if you go a few steps back, then it’s not, right? Like it comes in and out of the darkness, every single dollar. How do we confront and then forgive any place where we may be economically benefiting from someone else’s misfortune?

Which is a lot of the work I did with you in that year. 

[00:26:07] Rha: I mean, I think it is about a practice of awareness and intentional awareness and the recognition that even if you can’t trace it, you have to on some level because of the nature of the way our economy is designed, trust that it’s happening. Right?

And so, So the opportunity, and this was really, Kate, the breakthrough for me, was that I could create a personal economy. I have been handed an economy, all of us have been handed an economy, right? And in a lot of ways been taught that we are at the mercy of that economy. Yes. Right? Somebody says a recession, oh my god, we all run in reaction to the recession.

Somebody says it’s booming, oh my god, we all react in to, you know, in relationship to its booming. But I don’t know that I, until I began to really, really do the deep, deep liberation work on, in myself, I don’t know that I ever realized that I had the power to think about my own dollars, how I spent my money, where I invested, how I saved, what I did, and I’m in, you know, as God has continued to bless, you know, me and my family and the work and the world that we’re doing.

I mean, I’m continuing to ask those hard questions, you know, when we sit down with financial advisors, when we have those conversations, like, how do we do this? And I think you have to have a commitment in and of yourself to want to create an economy that reflects your values and to look at what you can do in order to do that, right?

And what are those day in, day out steps? In those places where your money is moving and you don’t know, like you, you haven’t been able to trace it back to the studs. Say a prayer and then look at how much more can you move in this direction. I try to invest in people I know. I try to spend my money with people I know and I love and I appreciate.

I also spend my money with people who take pride in their work, who joyful. You all know like those times when you walk into a store and you have an interaction with a shopkeeper and you’re like, Oh my God, like, fanned for life because you can feel the love, right? Whether it’s cookies, or it’s housewares, or you know, whatever it is.

I believe in the love that permeates the entrepreneurial spirit for many people, right? Everybody we know doesn’t get down that way, but there are many people who do. So, what I learned in… You know, as sort of central to being able to create a personal economy is how to spend with joy. How to earn with joy.

How to invest with joy. How to save with joy. Because if I can bring or feel a sense of joy, then to me there is good energy. There’s good juju with how I’m moving, right? And it’s less about lot watching numbers stack. And more about, for me, watching money move. I’m very interested in how money moves, right?

And I think one of the challenges we face with our scarcity based conditioning, and we all have it, just by virtue of being in this society, in this world, is we want to hold money. And when good intended, well intended money is held, you know, listen, God bless Lintwist, teach about that, teaches about this in the soul of money.

God bless Lintwist, right? When we hold it, it stagnates and, and there’s something that happens to the energy of it and the energy of it gets transformed. It’s, it’s no longer vibrant. It’s no longer life giving. It’s scared money. You know, so in hip hop we say, but scared money don’t make no money, right?

You know, and I want to say that scared money doesn’t transform and heal our planet either. So, it’s almost less about what you’re doing as much as it is energetically, what are you carrying in the context of what you’re doing every day, right? Knowing that you have unbelievable power in how you move your resources and that your ability to attract more, your ability to have more is deeply connected to the energy with which you give and share and spend and save and invest and so this, you know, my one word is intentionality, becoming more intentional, owning harm where harm happens, owning it, you know, and.

Thinking about what you want to do to counterbalance dollar for dollar, you know, for every one dollar I spend that goes in a way that I know doesn’t make things better, can I spend five dollars the other way? So that somehow the scale begins to tip in the other direction. 

[00:31:04] Kate: So what I hear you saying is that the energy and the intentionality that you do things with actually does impact the outcome. 

[00:31:14] Rha: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think being, you know and this, this is a courage piece, but it’s an important piece. And I say this with so much love and compassion because so many leaders, change agents, game changers that I’m talking to right now are in situations and circumstances where they do not feel respected, where they do not feel seen or appreciated, where they do not feel heard, where their efforts are being exploited.

Right? And we have to be willing to own where we participate, in our own demise, dare I say. Right? In our own disenfranchisement. And often, what we’ve been deeply conditioned to say, I need the money. And this is where those painful trading starts to happen. This is where the, the sort of. You know, the deterioration of our integrity, the dilution of our integrity, of our word, of our power, begins to happen because we’ve made money our God.

Whether we’ve wanted to or not. And of course, nobody wants to. But so much of the conditioning has taught us that this is what we have to do in order to survive. And until we can start to really challenge ourselves around that mentality. and poke holes in that argument to make different moves, make different decisions that grip, you know and, and that relationship between commerce and harming, it, it, it, harming yourself, like, that’s the deep thing.

We think, oh, I, I’m mindful about this sweatshop, right, in Guatemala, like, yes, but are you also mindful about The food, you know, the money you’re spending to put food on your own table and how that’s coming and the energy with which that, that gets exchanged, you know, we have to bless our money and we have an opportunity to have our money work in ways that can really invite a more workable world.

And that’s where the opportunity and where the work really, really happens. Because often my experience is when we’re caught in that conversation, we are actually doing the most harm to ourselves. And don’t, and don’t even realize it. 

[00:33:40] Kate: Do you think that As we do some of the personal healing work around our relationship with money, which you speak to so beautifully in the calling and honestly, in all of your work, do you think that, or how, I’ll just say how, does that, if at all, impact more of our collective and then also systemic structures and issues, and if we are looking at the inequities in the world, if we are looking at, you know, the problems of our economic systems Does personal healing work around money count?

In what ways? Can you talk about that? 

[00:34:15] Rha: Yeah, I think it’s central. Because systems are enacted by people. So even when we’re bumping up against structures and ways of operating and ways of being, there are people who are at the levers, who are pulling the levers of those conversations. And so if we’re not doing our internal work, We don’t get the sustainable shifts that we’re looking for.

And you look case in point, we can think about it. When we look at the political tithes, it goes in, it goes out. We step forward, we step back, , right? And Lord knows, if we consider particularly the last three years, man, we’ve been taking some very, very concerning steps back. Mm-hmm. . And so we have to work on every front.

And we have to be willing to work on every front. And we have to see the connection on every front. Like, wow, if I am doing my personal part, it creates a greater awareness and a greater capacity for me to see where are those other places where it’s happening or not happening. Also, when I’m in those conversations, I naturally draw and attract other people who are in those conversations.

And then we begin to have conversations about our collective dollar and what’s possible and what we can do. And I want to say for people who are wanting that to start to actively seek that out. Where are those communities where you can have conversations? I know for me, one of the biggest things that I had to do to transform my relationship with money was to step outside of my existing networks.

Because I was just not able to have the conversations that I needed to have that were integral to my ability to personally mentally, spiritually, emotionally thrive. And it was hard, because these were brilliant people, smart people, accomplished people, in lots of different ways, but there was no room to have the kind of authentic, courageous conversations that were necessary, so it just wound up being the elephant in the room, in the room, in the room, in the room, and you all know at some point you get tired of looking at the elephant.

And if you don’t feel like you can show courage in a room, which some people don’t. Then you need to find other rooms where those conversations are happening, where you get to draw on the courage of others in the room to then do that fierce looking. And I will say to you, this is where those masterminds and those groups become vital.

You know, sometimes we think we’re coming just for the curriculum and it’s like you’re coming because you have the opportunity to build lifelong relationships. With new ideas, and new people who are on the same journey that you’re on. 

[00:37:03] Kate: Yeah, and I will just say as a, you know, small example, I am in touch pretty regularly with the women that I went through that experience with.

And it has, and even just being part of your communities in other ways, too, has connected me with people I wouldn’t have connected with. Just in my regular life but they, and they may not appear to be on the same path as I am, but we are. And so that’s been invaluable. I want to talk about ambition, because I know the body of work you’ve been chewing on for the last couple of years and you’re working on your next book around, is about ambition.

So can you tell me, how do you define ambition? What is ambition? 

[00:37:45] Rha: Yeah, I think at its core, It is what really motivates and drives us to be all that we can be. And I think, particularly given the last three to four years, that we have all undergone a reset on ambition. For some of us, the reset is clear. For others of us, we are still grappling and wrestling.

But I think a fundamental shift that we are in the midst of is a renegotiation of our relationship with work and the role that work will play in our lives and the way in which work contributes or does not contribute to our success. So I think success is undergoing a redefinition. I think work is undergoing a redefinition.

And I think that we are asking ourselves and have been asking ourselves some really important questions. That we are trying to get to the answers to, which is what really does matter? What am I really willing to trade at this stage of the game, given all we’ve been through? What am I not willing to trade?

And I think there are lots of renegotiations that are happening as a result of the various forms of awakening that I think we’ve undergone over the last four years. You know, whether it’s, I’m not doing that two hour commute and bumper to bumper traffic anymore to, I gotta have 20 percent remote built into any role I’m taking to, I need to do work that feeds my soul, you know.

And I think the events of our world, our relationship, this is an interesting thing maybe to lean into a little bit more. I think pre the last four years. For many of us, it was kind of like our world over here and the rest of the world out there. And maybe the two would meet, occasionally, right? If I got invited to a banquet or, you know what I mean?

Or if my friend was doing some special project or But I think through the last, For years, we have become citizens of the world, meaning we can’t, we recognize, or starting to recognize, we can’t shut the rest of the world out. And so, as we start to look at what’s happening in the state of our lives, and the correlation between what’s happening in the state of our lives and what’s happening in the state of our world, we, we, we have some decisions to make.

We have some choices to make. One case in point, the murder of George Floyd. And what it awakened in the hearts and minds and spirit of people in the name of purpose is a line, a clear line I can draw. No matter what room I was in, what people began asking themselves is, am I doing something that matters?

Am I part of the solution or am I part of the problem? And I think those moments are still with people. Even though we’ve moved on in the news cycle and we’ve moved on in a lot of potential other ways. I think those moments of reckoning, first of all, I think they’re going to continue to come because they will.

But I think more and more people are asking those really important questions like, what do I want my life to be about? Because Whether we recognize it or not, you know, what is that famous, famous quote, how you spend your days is how you spend your life? Yep. This is what it is. And I think the sort of habit, deep habit we’ve been in, someday, one day, I’ll get to what matters.

Someday, one day, I’ll get to me. Someday, one day, I’ll get to what’s important. I think the jig is up on that. And that’s, that’s where I think we are right now is grappling, negotiate, renegotiating, sorting, trying to figure it out. I think our values in that, I think our money’s in that, I think our purpose is in that.

I think who we want to be in relationship with is in that. 

[00:42:10] Kate: Has there been anything for you over the last, you know, three to four years where you had a moment where you knew you needed to right size your relationship with your work and renegotiate? Yeah. Yeah. The the Constellation, I mean how different things happened.

[00:42:25] Rha: I’m in it right now. I’m in it right now, you know, and And I will say that for me personally George Floyd flipped a switch And That switch keeps continuing to get flipped in in that I Am being called to something else now, you know, I I feel a deep commitment to talk about self love. Because I feel like so much of what continues to keep people compromised is the degree to which they are or are not able to truly, truly love themselves.

And a lot of us even know like, yeah, I want to love myself, or I know I need to love myself. But we don’t know how. We’ve never been taught how. . So I feel like there’s so much in that. And then really healing the wounds of scarcity and separation. And that is gonna become essential. And money is one currency, but there are other currencies.

Yes. And healing are sense of not enough. The the and the way in which not enough continues to run the show and really govern our choices and our decision. My work has always been and will always be about liberation, but this is like the next cut. 

[00:43:51] Kate: I’m so excited to read your next book. So is there anything that you do every day that helps to continue to heal the lie of scarcity in you?

[00:44:03] Rha: Every morning, I have at minimum half an hour to 45 minutes where I’m just in. The arms of the all providing and cultivating and naturally nurturing the all providing, right? So I I have probably given away, shout out John Randolph Price, I’ve probably even given away a thousand copies, easily, of the Abundance book, and I will continue to give that book away.

I’m sure till my dying days, you know, and that beautiful ten mantras and 40 day prosperity plan that, that he so brilliantly channeled. and downloaded. But I’m also, interestingly right now, re reading the Tao Te Ching. And the correlation between the Tao Te Ching and John’s work and this work that I’ve been channeling in the context of the book.

And this whole idea that so much of what we’re really seeking are new ways of being that then allow us to be We need to be even more empowered in our situation and our circumstances. And I think this fundamental shift is helping people learn how to have them be bigger than their situation or their circumstances.

Because for many of us, our situation and our circumstances dictate what we say yes or no to in life. Right? And our ability to understand how to work with challenge. Our ability to understand how to work with grace. Our ability to let the good be good. Because even for many of us, when it’s good, we’re skeptical.

You know, we question it. So you know, the pivot and the shifts, for me, in those 45 minutes every morning, When I’m in those texts, and I’m in my journal, and I’m in my work are about continuing to open and continuing to find new levels of abundance in, in my day to day reality. 

[00:46:14] Kate: Yeah, and what you just said about even, you know, one of the most, what you just said reminded me of one of the most pivotal moments you and I had together.

Which is it was right after George Floyd, and we were on a call together, and I was talking about some promotions that we had had planned that summer, and I was like and really like it is helpful to people because it is so regulating to the nervous system and it helps them. We were talking about the planner in particular. It really actually does help them prioritize what matters so that they can have more space to care deeply around the about the world. 

[00:46:56] Rha: But I love that planner.

You are. 

I use that planner. I’m just just saying. Thank you. I swear by that planner. I’m just saying. 

[00:47:03] Kate: But I said, you know, it doesn’t feel okay to be, like, promoting anything that I make at this particular time as a white person. And do you remember what you said to me? Mm hmm. You say it. Yeah. Okay, I’ll say it.

You said, you said, Kate, white guilt is over. And I remember that so clearly because it spoke to the lie of scarcity. Which is the guilt is rooted in, in that, listen, some guilt is well founded and like we should have consequences for our actions and whatever. But in the context of this it, it helped for me to shift the, where my thinking, the error in my thinking, which is either I can be a hundred percent focused on on Black Lives Matter and George Floyd and, and whatever.

And I can completely take the focus off of my own business because there’s a lack of resources. There’s a lack of energy and we have to choose. We have to choose of somebody else’s wellbeing versus our wellbeing. And you just said something, which is, can we let good be good, right? And it speaks to that whole, Jumble that we can get into, which is like, if I am doing well, automatically somebody else is not.

[00:48:24] Rha: And yeah. 

[00:48:26] Kate: And what do you want to say?

[00:48:26] Rha: So many layers, right? There’s so many layers to this. And for me, it was one of the most heartbreaking conversations because I want to tell you, I have zero interest in guilt. I have a lot of interest in accountability. I have a lot of interest in accountability, but I have zero interest in guilt.

And I think so many things got jumbled and mumbled and people got lumped in all kinds of categories and it was messy, right? But I think at the heart of it is we have to believe in enough. We have to believe in plenty, right? Mm-hmm. and, and I say this even quoting my beloved Georgia Haas and the team at Modernist.

Shout out Modernist Financial, right? Believe in plenty. Believing enough that is one of their mantras. Okay, we’ll put that in the show notes, and I deeply, deeply, deeply, deeply believe that and whether we are. Calling each other in or calling each other forth, right? Because that’s what I say. I say, they’re calling you forth.

They’re not calling you out, they’re calling you forth. And, you know, you get to find your power in, in the opportunities where you’re being called forth, right? But there is more than enough. And we have to really, within all of our movements, We have to really look at the degree to which we are perpetuating the very systems and structures we say we want to dismantle when we start to go zero sum.

Any place where zero sum is playing, we are still in the old paradigm. And I’m telling you, there is no cheese down that tunnel. There just is not. I need you empowered. I need you bringing your brilliance. I need you in your purpose and your calling. I need you selling planners with all due respect, especially when it gets ultra hard because what else are people going to hold on to?

And so when we don’t step forward, when we don’t use our voice, when we’re not in our full embodied power, We get the alternative, and we all know what the alternative looks like. So, you get to choose. You know what I’m saying? And this is, and we’re at a real moment of reckoning, Kate. I’m not telling you anything you don’t know.

Because if the leadership seat winds up being granted by default, we are all in for a whirl, a whirlwind ride. You know? You gotta step up. Every single one of us has to step up, and nobody’s more is your less. We’ve gotta, we’ve gotta transform that. That’s our job to heal that. That’s part of our liberation theology.

[00:51:27] Kate: When you speak about the zero sum model, have you read Heather McGee’s The Sum of Us? 

[00:51:32] Rha: I have not, but I’ve heard of it. I’ve not read it, though. 

[00:51:34] Kate: When I read her data about that really there are enough resources for all of us to live a really good life on the planet I believe on like a spiritual level, and I know on a deep soul level that there is more than enough, but it was really helpful to have the data.

So if anybody is listening, and they’re like, I’m not sure that what Ra is saying is true, it’s actually true, and the data is there to prove it in the book, The Sum of Us. Okay. So my last question for you Ra, even though I want to talk to you for the next three days, if you could go back and chat with raw at, you know, at that transition point between adolescence into adulthood, you know, late teens, early twenties, as you’re going out into the world on your own, what would you want to tell yourself about money?

[00:52:23] Rha: That you are sourced by something so much greater than you could ever imagine. And that the work. And the opportunity is to cultivate that relationship with the all providing, the all providing energy. And if you can do that, then whatever you aspire to want or achieve will be yours. These days, I want less and less for myself.

I want more and more for our world. And so, you know, when we start to talk about this period of life and where we are and where we give less of to you know whats I’m thinking deeply about what I want to give the world before my time comes. And that, you know, and that’s, I think there’s an honor and a privilege to be able to be there.

You know but I want to say that, you know, it was a lot of, a lot of hours on a lot of meditation pillows, a lot of knees on a lot of rugs, a lot of heads on a lot of floors, a lot of prayers whispered to the heavens, y’all, you know, to get here. But but I would tell her that she is enough, that she is enough and that what sources her source is the universe and that the relationship is her divine inheritance.

And all she needs to do is own it, and claim it, and walk inside of it, and trust. 

[00:53:53] Kate: Thank you, Ra. I love you so much. Kate. Thank you. This conversation has been amazing.

So I know you have a beautiful place for people to dive deeper if they want to access the fount of wisdom. That is the channel of Raw Goddess. So what is it called? The link to it is in the show notes, but can you tell us a little bit about what that is?

[00:54:17] Rha: This is another one of those things you all where spirit would not let me rest, right?

Would just not let my soul rest. It was a training I created for our community this year and it is called Scarce No More. Time. Money. People. It is a three day, six hour training, meaning two hours a day. And we want to make the replay available to your community. And, and here’s the thing I want to say about this cake.

Cause you know, this is in this conversation of abundance and money, this is a 97 offer. Like y’all that’s like three lattes, maybe four, 

[00:54:57] Kate: maybe four. 

[00:54:59] Rha: You know what I’m saying? Right. Come on. If you maybe take out a shot, an extra shot of expresso, it might be four lattes. But my point is we are practically giving this training away because I want you to have the information.

It was channeled for me. It was game changing doing it. It was deeply impactful for our community. And it is… The work I think we’re all being called to do right now and whether your currency is time or your currency is money. And it’s so funny, Kate, because people came in like, Oh, you know, I’ll wait for the money part.

Or, Oh, you know what I’m saying? Oh, I’m going to get on the time part. Oh, by the time we got to people, people were laid out because we do not talk about people’s scarcity. Yeah. And the way in which scarcity around people.

And so I’ll just tell you a little tiny teaser around the people piece. I talk about the five types of people you want to have in your life, and I break it down. So you actually get one of the things you get coming out of that training is a map where you can actually see, wow, who are my people and in what roles are they fulfilling?

And you get to evaluate. Okay. You know, where you want to create and invite more, where you may want to shift and realign with less all of those things become available when you can see, when you can see.

[00:56:33] Kate: Okay, well, I’m going to be going to go through that training myself. It’s called Scare Snow More.

Get the link at the link in the show notes, wherever we are here. Is there anywhere else that you would want people to come find you? Obviously, you know, they need to get their copy of the calling. 

[00:56:48] Rha: If you feel called, you know, I would be honored if the book can in any way support you, but I’m on, you know, Instagram at Rha, and it’s R H A, goddess and then LinkedIn, Rha goddess, you know, and, and come say hello or ask me a question. I’d be my joy to get to know you. 

Kate: Thank you, Rha. I love you. 

Rha: Love you too. 

[00:57:08] Kate: I mean, you can see why she’s been in my world for years and will continue to be so forever, as long as we both shall live. So I know that you will have some very strong takeaways. You may even want to just turn this recording off and sit for a moment and allow what you just received to sink in.

I’m going to do the same. Of course, of course, go get Ra’s book, go get yourself access to Scare Snow more. If you liked this episode, share it with a friend, pass it along, continue the flow of abundance, rate the episode, subscribe. Thank you for being here and I will see you next time for the next episode of Plenty.

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